Blog by Marshele Scherrer

Most of us write a “to-do list” each day. We sit down with our cup of joe each morning and, as we read through our emails, we create a list of all of the tasks we have to do that day.  When was the last time you woke up and created your “goal list”? Many do not realize the difference between setting goals and setting tasks. A quick run down…

Tasks are things that you are going to get done eventually. No matter what—going grocery shopping, for instance, will get done. You may eat out five nights in a row before you actually go to the grocery store, but at some point, you will buy groceries.

Goals are things that are not going to happen unless you make a conscious effort to achieve them. Examples of this may be running a marathon or starting your own business. Goals are what inspire and motivate you. Goals require a sense of possibility.  Soren Kierkegaard says this about possibility,

“If I were to wish for anything, I should not wish for wealth and power, but for the passionate sense of the potential, for the eye which, ever young and ardent, sees the possible. Pleasure disappoints, possibility never. And what wine is so sparkling, what so fragrant, what so intoxicating, as a possibility!”

There are three things that I want to mention about the possibility as it relates to goals.

1) Possibility allows the past to stay the past.

2) It provides ways to overcome or remove constraints.

3) Possibility comes from above the line.

More specifically, in my opinion, there is an invisible and sometimes indistinguishable line where our motives reside which can impact how successful we will be in achieving our goals. For example, if a goal is set below the line on the foundation of anger, jealousy or fear, we are less likely to achieve those goals. However, when we create goals driving above the line from a place of passion, confidence, or commitment, we empower ourselves to succeed.

My challenge to you today is to discover your “possibility.” Before setting your day-to-day tasks, make sure you take the time to set goals. You can set your goals for next week, for the next year and for the next ten years. This way your daily tasks align with bigger goals that align with your purpose.

Exciting news! We just finished designing a new website for the Harvard Kennedy School Alumni Community of San Diego! We worked with them to design a site that features their events (check out their amazing upcoming events), takes alumni membership registration, and servers as a hub for those interested in government/ political related happenings in San Diego. In the interim, we also helped them design a landing page (before the site was live) and social media sites. Congrats to HKS@SD on the launch of your new site, and thank you for all of the great things you're doing for the San Diego community!

Guest blog by Haney Hong

If you’re familiar with the term “strategic planning,” you may associate it with lofty goal making, lots of time spent in frustrating conversations, and money spent on glossy documents that gather dust; if not, it may just sound like an abstract exercise meant for the brainy eggheads in your company or organization. Truth be told, it’s none of the above if done right and strategic planning may be the very process that helps keep your doors open while your peers or competitors find themselves in varying stages of irrelevance.

Good strategic planning results in an imagined story of your future value to others. And while it isn’t hard to write a good story, it takes a few commitments to let your imagination run. You have to make deliberate assumptions to simplify the future. You have to tolerate risk to achieve something big. And you have to trust your gut and jump. A participant in a recent strategic planning session I facilitated said it well: “You have to place the hard bets, and you have to be willing to ante up.”

Strategic planning writes a story, and next month, I’ll want to discuss with you the process of story writing and get your thoughts about those commitments above. In future months, I’ll also want to dialogue with you on the leadership, followership, and management of change to turn that written story into real life. But before digging into either, I think it’s important to recognize why having a strategy–a story–is so important.

Having worked with organizations of varying missions and at different stages of growth, I’ve encountered some common problems:

1. The day-to-day tasks of employees don’t align with business goals or “the-way-it’s-done” putters along inefficiently, lowering morale and motivation. Time–and therefore salary or payroll costs–is spent on miscellany that does not contribute to the core business, and this wasted time and money perpetuates itself.
2. There are a lot of good–and bad–ideas on how to make things better, but there’s either no way to share and explore them or no ability for leaders to be secure in their decisions, including resource allocation, on those ideas.
3. Work moves along every day with no real challengers (“this is the way we’ve always done it”), but the organization gets caught off guard when someone leaves for a better opportunity, a competitor swoops in and grabs market share, or a new product makes yours irrelevant.

A strategy–a story–is important because it unifies everyone behind what your business does and prevents these common problems from occurring. It motivates your employees to bring their creativity to bear, because they know why they are doing what they do. It gives your leaders an ability to decide what to do, as the story talks about how you bring value to others. It prevents strategic surprise, because the story recognizes many of the villains that will take you off track.

Your strategy is important, because it’s how you talk about your future. But when you forget your story, someone else’s story becomes what’s told.

Post originally published on hdhaa.com.

Over the years, we've developed a list of favorite tools that can help to streamline your day-to-day and increase productivity. Check it out...

Mobile Office

• Turboscan (scanner app)
• Dropbox (save your docs in the cloud)
• Google Drive

Task Management Tools

• Remember the Milk
• OmniFocus
• Basecamp (great for groups)

Communication Tools

• Skype
• Freeconferencecall.com

Free Text Messages

• Kakao Talk
• Viber
• Whatup App

News Feeds

• Bloglovin (Follow blogs)
• Feedly (Follow sites)

Photo Editing

• Camera+ (edit photos)
• Overgram (overlay text on photos)

Stay Connected

• Wi-Fi Finder App (searches for free and paid wi-fi near you)
• Boingo Wi-Finder App

Heading out?

• Yelp App
• Starbucks App
• Foodspotting

What are your favorite tools to run your business from anywhere?

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Once you are clear on your unique selling proposition (USP), it's time for you to focus on your target market, otherwise known as your “persona.” Your persona is absolutely key, because it is going to help you to attract your ideal prospects.

To start, think back over the years about your best clients. Who are they? What did they sound like? How did they talk? How did you sell them on the deal? What channels do they use to communicate—e.g., over the phone, via email, or on social media? What do they read or listen to? What zip codes do they work and live in? 

Get really specific, as all these insights will help your marketing team with the positioning and at-large strategic game plan. 

The good news is you can ideally have more than one target market. It’s best to have one overarching target market and several sub-targets underneath it. 

Be careful to not get carried away. If you try to target everyone under the sun, your resources will be diluted. It’s only the Morgan Stanleys and Gallaghers of the world that are able to deploy an enormous amount of resources and ad dollars to target everyone. As a mid-sized company, you’ll get the most use of your resources if you zero in on your target and serve up personalized content and campaigns that reach them. 

Why is this important?

By identifying not only the prospects you want to be your clients, but also those who respond best to your campaigns and digital marketing efforts, you’ll be able to identify your true “perfect client.” This will help you target the most relevant and most responsive clients in future ads and marketing. 

Clarity around your target market is key to help ensure the resources you spend on marketing (and sales) are targeted and help reach your ideal prospects. Doing this will help you save time, energy, and money, thereby improving click through rate (CTRs), return on investment (ROI), client runover, and cost per click (CPC) on your campaigns and marketing tactics. Homing in on your perfect client will be more efficient and effective for your business and will likely lead to attracting more long-term, happy clients.

Want to learn more about effective digital marketing techniques? Visit our blog.

To have a successful working relationship, we need to put a roadmap in place. After the items below are completed, we can craft a custom marketing strategy to help you grow and scale your business. 

What do you need to prepare internally to best support us if we are to partner? We’re glad you asked! Here is a checklist of information we will need from you to get started.

Goal Setting

• What are your company’s vision, mission and values?
• What are your 1-, 3- and 5-year goals? What are your long-term goals (think 10+ years)? These are goals for your company and not just marketing goals. We don’t need hyper details, but we need just enough to help us understand major priorities and focus. 

Audience

• What is your current and ideal target market?
• What core problem do you solve for ideal clients?

Marketing Strategy

• What have you done in the past for marketing? What has worked and what has not? 
• Who are your primary competitors?
• What is your primary competitive advantage?

Communication (please share name and contact information)

• Who is our day-to-day contact?
• Who is your administrative coordinator? This person will help with printing, event prep and other more administrative items.
• Who manages operations and has access to email list management?

Onboarding

• We will send you a checklist of files, logins and more we will need to get started
• We will get you onboarded with our project management tool, Asana
• What you can expect from us:some text
  • Discovery call (1.5 hours)
  • Follow-up meeting from the discovery call to go over the game plan (1 hour)
  • Weekly check-in meetings
  • Regular communications and project updates via Asana

Following the pandemic and subsequent Great Resignation, prospective employees want more in their careers than just fair compensation. Company culture, the norms, people, and values behind your brand, is quickly hiking up their priority list. Why is it influential? When a highly sought-after candidate has comparable offers from multiple firms, company culture is the clincher.

Expectations, workplace benefits, leadership style, and other factors drive productivity, performance, employee satisfaction, and turnover—in both directions. Whether calibrated or misaligned, culture ultimately affects your firm’s clientele, balance sheet, growth, and longevity. Here are three ways your firm can market its company culture to recruit and retain qualified professionals who enrich your organization.

#1 Define and Create an Authentic Culture

Company culture is more than a snazzy HR poster in your breakroom. It is ever-present and intrinsic to your firm. Only your firm can define what your culture means to you—and apply it  to the people you hire, how you support one another professionally and personally, and what measures success. 

Don’t have an accurate pulse on your culture? Engage your team. What better way to define values and standards and improve morale than to invite your employees to help establish them? Clarity is your firm’s accountability and is crucial, especially since new hires can easily sniff out disorganization and mistrust. Here are three employee engagement strategies to get started:

• Conduct an eNPS survey.
  • You may be familiar with a Net Promoter Score (NPS) survey measuring customer satisfaction. An eNPS assesses your employees based on a single question. The survey cannot provide a complete picture of your employees’ experience but is an effective and simple way to capture a baseline to compare progress in subsequent years.
• Hold group and one-on-one meetings.
  • Share a pre-meeting agenda outlining the purpose, prompts, and questions you’ll cover, such as “What is your favorite part about working here?” and “How do you think we can improve?” Ensure the meeting is a collaborative, open forum that remains on track and allows each team member to express their views.
  • Schedule ongoing meetings to gauge employee satisfaction, share company updates, and gain employee buy-in about the firm’s vision and direction.
• Establish core values.
  • As a team or among a key group of leaders, drill down into what makes your firm and culture unique. For example, one of Uber’s core values is “Diversity makes us stronger.” Document and share the values with your team and explain expectations for how you will demonstrate and uphold them.
  • Keep cultural norms top of mind by integrating core values into your processes, communications, and meetings. A simple exercise is to conclude discussions with how the team sees them in action and areas that need work.

#2 Share Your Culture Online

Prospective talent is scrolling your social media and website to gauge cultural fit. Leverage these platforms to showcase what makes your firm unique and attractive. Here are four ways to promote your culture online:

• Weave it into your social media marketing strategy. Your social feeds are highly effective in highlighting cultural aspects that make your firm a desirable place to work. Regularly integrating the following types of cultural posts in your social calendar demonstrates your firm’s ethos and commitment to longevity and team engagement:
  • New hires and work anniversaries
  • Peeks into a day-in-the-life or behind-the-scenes of your firm
  • “Best Places to Work"-esque awards
  • Team outings like happy hours and holiday gatherings
  • Community involvement, including volunteering and giving back together
• Make your team page human. Don’t be afraid to add flair to your “Meet the Team” page. This part of your website is a chance for your employees to shine and reflect the fun, diversity of skills and people, and other characteristics your culture embodies. Consider the following approaches:
  • Headshots that are less stuffy and show each team member’s distinct character
  • Personal anecdotes, including fun facts or life mottos
  • Quotes or videos that share the employee’s favorite part of working with your firm
• Liven up your job descriptions and profiles. Legal and role specifics are essential to setting up potential hires for success. However, job descriptions and company profiles on sites like LinkedIn and Indeed are other opportunities to use your company culture to win over prospects. Here’s how you can help them stand out:
  • Produce a branded welcome video introducing your firm, team, and quirks.
  • Avoid overused, outdated jargon and language, crafting job descriptions and company profiles with conversational, relatable messaging.
  • Include a range of photos full of personality that capture happy, valued, and real employees.
  • Outline benefits that resonate with the type of applicants you wish to attract, incentives such as flexible or remote hours, career path opportunities, paid parental leave, wellness perks, “take your dog to work” days, and more— anything that makes your firm enticing.
• Develop a New Hire Toolkit. A new member guide is handy for sales teams and staff out in the community to consistently represent your brand. The kit can include promotional materials, such as:
  • Social media post templates that employees can share on their networks, e.g., “I'm thrilled to share that I've joined the (@FIRMNAME) team, where (FIRM TAGLINE).”
  • Style-approved social media profile pictures, banners, email signatures, and logos
  • Branded polos and other items your team can sport to raise firm visibility

#3 Be Consistent (Yet Open)

A thriving company culture is consistent at every touchpoint. Firms are responsible for preserving and representing their established culture, systems, and standards. For example, team members and clients should have similar experiences online, over the phone, and in person. Without order and consistency, alignment and trust may crumble. 

When a firm grows, continuity becomes the cornerstone of investing in its people and long-term success. Employees value consistency and stability, knowing they can rely on standards to solve problems, advance in their careers, and communicate and gain feedback from leaders. As a result, employees have the peace of mind to perform better, which reflects in client service and loyalty. 

It is equally important to ensure your culture is flexible enough to accommodate new perspectives and innovations. Prospective hires seek broad-minded workplaces that value team members’ opinions, concerns, and changing needs.

You may have already established a positive and supportive workplace culture. But top-tier talent will only notice your firm on their job hunt if you promote it strategically and intentionally. Now is the time to use these tips to showcase your unique culture and get applicants and clients excited to partner with you.

What’s the difference between hi-res design files, medium, and low-res? Check out the video above to hear more about these different types of files, learn how to use them, and see some examples. 

Resolution refers to the number of pixels in an image. More pixels means higher resolution, which means a crisper image and a larger file size. And the opposite is also true.

How do you know when to use which resolution? Let’s break down the three main sizes of design files and when to use which ones. 

Low Resolution 

This is great for getting feedback on overall design and for sending back and forth during the design process. It’s a smaller file size, so great for email or communication, but not great for printing.

Medium Resolution

The file size here is smaller than a high-resolution image, so it can be good for sending back and forth during a design process, especially if you want it a little crisper or sharper than a low-resolution image. It’s also a great option for really big images that are viewed from far away, such as a billboard; you won’t be able to see the pixels because your perspective will be so far off, so you don’t need the highest resolution. 

High Resolution

This image has the highest number of pixels and it’s ideal for sending to print, many digital ads, photography and images on websites, and so forth. These are the final design files you use for client-facing ads. These are the largest files, but are also the best quality images. 

Whether we’re starting the initial phases or finalizing a design project, the size we use makes a difference, not only for everyone’s inbox, but also for the end goal of the project itself. 

You can learn more about our entire process for working with clients here. 

Episode Summary

In this episode of The Out & About Podcast, Tiffany and Lauren unpack one of the most common questions financial services firms bring to the table: how to generate more client and COI (centers of influence) referrals without turning the experience into a transactional or automated tactic. They talk about what they see working across RIAs, payroll companies, lenders, and banking teams, and why authentic, people-first outreach still outperforms scripted requests or mass referral emails. (And yes, Tiffany’s dog made a brief cameo during the recording!)

Throughout the conversation, they explore why referrals rely on trust, how to identify your “true COIs,” and why nurturing relationships should be 90% of the work.

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Key Takeaways:

This episode breaks down how referrals really work in financial services and why the most effective strategies feel personal, thoughtful, and rooted in genuine value. 

• Problem statement: Many firms rely heavily on referrals but struggle to generate them consistently. Automated “ask for a referral” tactics fall flat, and teams may be unaware of their true COIs or how to nurture the right relationships in a meaningful way. 
• Why it matters: Referrals are often a top source of new business, which is why many firms want to “do more of what’s working.” But that’s where they get stuck. Referrals rely on trust and genuine connection, so understanding how to create people-first experiences that naturally lead to being recommended is critical. 
• Real‑life example: One client we work with recently wrote a guide to help people navigate a highly emotional life stage, then shared it not as a sales pitch but as a resource clients could pass along to someone who might need it. Instead of directly asking for referrals, they offered something genuinely helpful — naturally opening the door for clients to forward it to friends or family going through similar situations. 
• A few moments that made us stop and think: 
  
  • Get real: The difference between adding value and asking for a referral is often timing and the authenticity behind it. 
  • Focus on referring the right clients: Even strong referral activity can create friction if it brings in people who aren’t aligned with your ideal client. Keeping your target clear helps the right relationships grow.  
  • Framing the ask matters: Instead of “Can you send us a referral?” share the impact you made and why you love doing the work. Clients respond when the conversation feels mission-driven, not transactional. 
  • Trinkets don’t drive referrals: Branded gifts can be a nice gesture but they won’t spark new business on their own. What moves someone to refer is feeling genuinely supported, understood, and helped — not receiving another logoed item. 

Events can be slow to close: “Bring-a-friend” events and curated experiences can work but they rarely lead to immediate conversions. Their value comes from creating memorable interactions that strengthen relationships and open the door for future conversations.
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Don’t Miss the ONE Thing You Should Go Do First!‍

• Stay authentic. Focus on nurturing real relationships before you think of making an ask. When outreach comes from a genuine place of adding value, referrals follow naturally.

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Links & Resources

• Previous Episode #6: Financial Services SEO: What You Need to Know in an AI World
• Blog: How to Plan Strategic, Effective Events for Financial Services with Angela York and Elyse Stoner
• Blog: Why Emotionally Connecting with Clients is Good for Business in Financial Services with Brendan Frazier
• Thinking about client gifts? Check out the client-gifting article we referenced: Thinking Outside the Gift Box — the Art of Creative Client Gifting

Join Us! 

• Want more practical ideas? Join the Out & About newsletter for fresh insights into financial services marketing and exclusive downloadable resources.

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Transcript

Tiffany (00:10):

I feel like this is coming up in all our client conversations lately.

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Lauren (00:13):

What I'm excited about is the opportunity to continue to lean back into the basics of just building authenticity offline and online as well. 

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Tiffany (00:24):

We remember what we do on a tactical day to day but we forget how it's impacting people. Hello everyone. Welcome back to The Out & About Podcast, where we break down all things marketing in financial services, especially what we're seeing and what we're not. I always say that wrong — what we're seeing working and the stuff that's not working, which is exactly what we're going to dive into today. So whether you've been in the marketing seat for your whole career or just sat down and are not sure where to start, we're here to support. So Lauren is with me today again, and we're talking about a very hot topic, client referrals. I feel like this is coming up in all our client conversations lately, how to get clients to bring in more business. So that's going to be a whole can of worms. So shall we dive in?

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Lauren (01:16):

Yeah, let's do it. It's such a hot topic right now. Honestly, it's been a hot topic for a while but I feel like it's come up more and more. So something's in the water.

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Tiffany (01:24):

Something's in the water. I know. Yeah. Well, we'll get into it. We have theories but what are you saying yes to? What are you excited about when it comes to client referrals?

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Lauren (01:37):

Honestly, the authentic conversations that can happen around client referrals, which I know might sound kind of silly, but with the world of AI today and everything, feeling so just like em dash everywhere and plug and play, it just strips the human component. And I feel like the financial services industry at large is so about people, and lets not forget that, and referrals are so about people and trust. So what I'm excited about is the opportunity to continue to lean back into the original, the basics of just building authenticity offline and online as well.

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Tiffany (02:17):

Yeah, that's such a good point. Okay, so what I was going to say is sort of the opposite. I get really excited when we're talking with clients about referrals and they talk about having an internal hub, like an intranet sort of thing of client stories or success stories they've had so advisors or teammates or just anyone in the sort of sales or business development position can tap back into reminding themselves of what they've done for clients to get those stories going. 

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Lauren (03:03):

Yes.

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Tiffany (03:04):

Yeah, some sort of resource internally.

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Lauren (03:06):

Totally.

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Tiffany (03:07):

Yeah. I feel like it can be easy to forget what you do, like you said, on a human level. So I guess maybe it is sort of the same. We remember what we do on a tactical day to day but we forget how it's impacting people.

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Lauren (03:20):

Yeah, totally.

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Tiffany (03:24):

Okay, well, first of all, I just said firms and things like that, but as I mentioned at the beginning, we serve financial services across the board. So we want to talk today a little about not only the RIA space but also payroll or banking because I know there's some compliance things going on, especially in the RIA space, SEC rules and things like that. But sometimes we can tap into other types of firms and companies to get some fresh ideas.

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Lauren (03:55):

Absolutely.

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Tiffany (03:56):

Okay. You're going to see me looking over here because honestly, like I said, this comes up all the time in our client conversations. So we have some super nitty gritty questions.

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Lauren (04:07):

Do it. 

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Tiffany (04:07):

So I think the reason this is such a big topic is because a lot of times word of mouth is the top source of referrals, and so we talk with firms, we re-strategize at the end of the year looking into the new year, and it's like, okay, well if this is working, we should do more of what's working. That's the logic. But then how do we actually do that? What's the next step? So yeah, I guess that's the first question. Big picture. How do we get more clients to refer business to your company?

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Lauren (04:47):

So I was given some advice a while ago that I felt was really beneficial, which is, okay, well, this seems like an obvious marketing play, but you have to know your target audience, right?

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Tiffany (04:59):

Yeah.

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Lauren (05:00):

So with that, and this is probably no surprise to any listener, the people who are going to refer you business are the ones who are really, really close to your target market, where they're a trusted ally. So it could be in a consultancy. We see CPAs, we see other business owners. You think about the payroll space or 401(k) space referring — this is someone I worked with, a trusted resource. If it's in the advisor space, it could be that one of their current clients has a friend but they're a trusted partner. So when you think about your COIs, you might have a lot of contacts but that doesn't necessarily mean they're really, really close to those specific COIs, or excuse me, your specific client. So the first thing to do is kind of audit your list.

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(05:52):

Start to go through your list and ask yourself, is this a true COI, someone who’s literally a trusted resource back and forth to my prospective clients? And if not, that's okay. You can put them on the network list or community list or something like that but your true COIs are the ones you're going to want to nurture. And when I say nurture, this might sound weird from a marketer but that doesn't mean you're going to put them down this drip campaign that just feels automated.

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(06:20):

It’s got to come from a genuine place because again, a referral is coming from a place of trust. So these are the people — you might have a blog post you wrote and you're like, oh my gosh, it makes me think of, I don't know, John, who's a consultant at so-and-so, and this was the exact thing we're talking about yesterday or last week. Let me shoot that over to him. It might be meaningful, or you want to add value. These are the people you're going to want to check in with on a regular basis. If they're coming into town or you're going to a conference, you're going to want to make an effort to see them. You're going to want to add value to their lives and be able to stay top of mind. So be really clear about who your referrals are or who your true COIs are that could actually refer business. And frankly, it might only be a half a dozen people, and that's okay. 

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Tiffany (07:04):

It's not very big. That's what we hear all the time. So I also think it's important to really narrow down that target market too, because from the client referral side of things, you could start getting people to refer, but if they're not your target, if you're not your ideal, then you're just getting in business that doesn't feel good. So I think that's going to be part of it too, is making sure you're really narrowing down not only who's going to give you a referral but also that they're referring the right type of people so you don't get frustrated. So then the big question is always, do we just ask clients for referrals? How do we go about that?

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Lauren (07:49):

It can be kind of awkward, right?

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Tiffany (07:52):

Yeah.

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Lauren (07:53):

Super awkward. I like to say sometimes that the best marketing is the marketing you don't even know you're being marketed to.

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Tiffany (07:59):

Yes.

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Lauren (07:59):

I say that with referrals because sometimes it feels really awkward. Are you ready to send this email? Do you know anyone who can work with us? It just feels awkward sometimes and it feels, I don't know, disingenuous or it's like emotion, like a transaction. So I think part of it is you have to own the intuition for when's the time to write, ask for that referral, and it might be a conversation you're having with someone and they just said, we're just so grateful you helped us see these things we didn't see about our financial situation, or you just helped us make our payroll processing so much easier. Or now I have access to this loan. I'm just so grateful, and it's like, I'm so glad we were able to help you with that. That's an opportunity to ask. We're in a stage of looking to help others. Let us know if there's anything we can do, or we're having this event and do you want to join? Do you know anyone else who could join? It's got to come through an authentic value add. Sometimes it's about the timing and when to ask, and not just this transaction of, okay, every quarter I'm going to send an email that asks for referrals.

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Tiffany (09:10):

Unless that's right.

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Lauren (09:12):

Yeah, unless that's right for your business. What do you think about that? Because it's kind of awkward, right? 

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Tiffany (09:17):

Yeah, I think you were hitting on something a second ago, which I think is part of it too. Sometimes I feel like you don't necessarily have to ask for the referral but sometimes people don't know you want a referral. So I love how you said, so the conversation is going, oh my goodness, you helped us so much get this loan and now our business is growing or payroll finally is working, whatever the thing is, you finally helped us through this thing. I think that's an opportunity to say that's what we love to do. We love to do that for people, and we'd love to continue to do that for more people. If you ever hear of anyone, I mean, it could just be that simple, but I think it's framing it less in can you send us a referral and more that's what gets us excited. That's what we love to do. We'd love to do more of that. That's the impact we want to have in the world. It's almost like going back to your mission statement or something. 

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Lauren (10:12):

Totally. It's this opportunity where your passion shines and you get to say why we love doing that, and it's exactly what you said. It'll just sound like a broken record. Yeah, yeah.

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Tiffany (10:26):

But I guess part of that, Lauren, is it's not a marketing tactic. It really has to come from the culture of the firm. So that's something we've worked on with a lot with clients. How do you build that referral culture within the firm or the company or just how do you make that a thing without becoming a salesy team? 

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Lauren (10:51):

We've talked about culture champions before here within our own company, and being able to set those tones to be able to model examples. I think that's one thing. If there's someone who’s really kind of championing that or leading that to be able to put that on a public spotlight, like an all-hands meeting or maybe through an award of something and calling out and seeing that's a model for what others can do, and having that regular drumbeat of values and having that be really showcased. I know here we do shoutout channels on Slack. We are really honoring and celebrating different things people are doing to really live out that culture and those values. 

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Tiffany (11:30):

Also, sorry, can you put a pin in that? Because also in those channels, I think it's a matter of calling out again, what makes clients happy. I'm just thinking of some examples. We just built a website. The client raved every time we're on the call with them, they love the new website. So it's always reminding the team, they love the design, they love the look and feel. They love how easy it is to use those specifics so it's built into the culture of oh, that's what we're really good at. We're really good at these things that make clients happy.

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Lauren (12:01):

Yeah, totally. And then I think hitting it from what I'll call a business KPI perspective. We talk a lot about Net Promoter Score and really talking about client satisfaction and showcasing those kinds of numbers, why it's important, and then letting that waterfall into things like the shoutout channels, the culture of really raising up what our strengths are, and so on and so forth. So those are ways, I think, also helping folks on this is a very tactical thing but getting into a pattern of awareness around what content has gone out.

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(12:39):

And what I mean by that is maybe a really great podcast on a certain, I don't know, end of year charitable planning went out that could be really beneficial to a lot of your clients. Or maybe there's some upsell sheet or something like that that somebody else has seen success with, and they can tell that case study, sharing that with the group and encouraging other people to share, to be able to stay top of mind with others to be able to add that value. So I think culturally, internally sharing those as we were talking about earlier, those success stories, but then arming it with content that can be leveraged to be able to further narrate the why or the upsell or whatever it might be.

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Tiffany (13:24):

Yeah. So I feel like that's a really important dive inside of the tactical side of things. I have some specific questions of what we see haven't worked, but one thing that can work is like you said, value add type. So we wrote a really good blog post and making sure your clients are seeing that if it's, again, on point to their target and their pain points and things like that, your target market, their pain points, your solutions, but just making sure you're getting it in front of them on a regular basis, whether that's in your newsletter, making sure all your clients are in your newsletter, or maybe somebody who's in the business development seat is sending a one-off, but hey, if you know anyone who could benefit from this. We're working with a client on this right now, actually, I can't say what it is, but they help people in sort of a certain emotional time of life, and they've written a whole guide on it, and they've broken it down into some emails and social posts and things like that. And it is very much like, okay, you might not need this but you might know someone who needs this. And so it's not like we're asking for a referral but it's a free resource that could help somebody through this sort of emotional time, and then at least they know this firm exists. Right?

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Lauren (14:47):

Totally.

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Tiffany (14:48):

They wouldn't have known before.

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Lauren (14:49):

It makes me think about, I'm sure you've received, or others who are listening have received this. So have you ever gotten, this feels a little old school, but a snail mail note from someone, like a card or a clip from a newspaper or something.

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Tiffany (15:03):

Open me up, your aunt cuts out the newspaper.

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Lauren (15:07):

Yes. Like a mentor or somebody and they wrote something to you that just really stood out to you, or this article made me think of you, and you're like, if I got those, I was like, wow, this person, they really took the effort. They thought of me. I mean, honestly and stuff I've kept some, and it meant something. And the same thing can happen by just taking the effort. You have to put in the effort. It took effort to put in that note, sending a warm note to someone to be like, this made me think of you in our conversation and blah, blah, blah. That feels so authentic and genuine. And that's basically the same thing. It's just making the effort to be able to leverage something you saw that could help somebody at this stage of their lives.

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Tiffany (15:54):

Yeah.

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Lauren (15:55):

That's a feeling.

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Tiffany (15:57):

So then it's helping clients be able to do that as well. So send it to your client, Bob, and hopefully he knows, oh, Sarah could really benefit from this. And so making things easily shareable and forwardable and all of that. Okay. Here's a deep tactical question. So putting at the bottom a newsletter, forward this to a friend, have we seen any impact with that?

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Lauren (16:21):

No. Don't waste your time on it. So we've tested it, we've seen it. We've had clients who say we have to do this, and we literally tested it for a hot minute over a year. It's going to be at the footer of the email. We've seen it in all different forms and fashions. The click rate on that is not totally zero, but pretty close to it. It's very low.

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Tiffany (16:46):

Referrals have to not feel like a tactic. I think that's the reality.

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Lauren (16:50):

That's it.

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Tiffany (16:50):

Yeah.

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Lauren (16:51):

That's it. I mean, it feels like an easy thing to pop in there, but people want to refer because they want to help somebody else. Right?

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Tiffany (17:03):

There it is.

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Lauren (17:04):

They trust you to make them look good, and they want to make sure the person they're sending in is going to actually add value. If not, then it starts to erode that trust. So that's part of it. It's a very high trust kind of thing, and that's why you can close them faster, because if you are crushing it, not just the close, but actually the longevity of the relationship, then it's going to keep paying itself forward. And that person who referred is going to keep referring because they know whoever they're going to refer in is going to be taken good care of. They know they've been taken really well care of. 

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Tiffany (17:44):

Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So what about invite a friend type of events, like client events you can bring a friend to? Thoughts on? 

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Lauren (17:57):

Slow to close.

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Tiffany (17:59):

Yeah.

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Lauren (17:59):

But yes, that is a tactic you can deploy. What have you seen in talking with clients too?

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Tiffany (18:08):

Yeah, I mean, I feel like it has to be, I mean, if you look at the numbers, the steak dinner type of thing still works. So I mean, it's still out there for a reason, but I do think more creative thinking around it is more effective. So again, going back to your target market, and I don't know, special events, curated types of events, special experiences and opportunities people wouldn't have otherwise. So it doesn't feel like a sales pitch, but it feels like, oh, this company I work closely with got us this. I don't know, art, I can't think of anything. Right? But this museum, the art museum opportunity, so we go and talk with the museum curator or something.

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Lauren (18:57):

A behind the scenes kind of thing. 

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Tiffany (18:59):

I think that's effective or more effective of, or also just, sorry, thought I had an example come into my mind, so the other thought just went away. But the other one is networking. So if you're serving all doctors, if doctors are not a good example, and a lot of professionals are not because they don't have time.

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Lauren (19:25):

They’re busy.

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Tiffany (19:26):

But if there are other people, basically like salespeople or other people who need to network. 

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Lauren (19:34):

Things like that. But going back to the doctor example, it could be like CE credits or something like that. You were able to pair with somebody that can have a ripple effect.

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Tiffany (19:43):

And learning events. We have seen work really well. So not just the standard steak dinner, retirement planning, but deeper emotional retirement planning, how to choose a retirement home, those or retirement living situations, those types of things where it's true learning. I think those can be effective as well. Then you're like, yeah, I should bring Sally. She's been wondering about this.

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Lauren (20:10):

I mean, the key to all this I feel is you're actually impacting someone's life in a positive way. It's a value add.

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Tiffany (20:17):

Yeah.

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Lauren (20:18):

It's, I thought of you when I read this and I thought it might be beneficial in your life, or maybe someone else who went through a similar situation, or if it's inviting them to an event that makes them feel special, you're adding value, and that's what we want to do. We want to be able to add value, create impact, make a difference. That's the stickiness to the relationships too.

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Tiffany (20:41):

Yeah, absolutely. The reason my thought got stuck, I was thinking we have a real estate company we worked with. I mean personally, not at, but they always have their standard events every year, so on Thanksgiving, all their old clients get a free pie and things like that. I don't know how effective that is. I've never been to one of those but I think the more effective ones are the experiences. They do a summer barbecue movie on the big screen for the kids, that kind of thing. Those are probably more effective or like, oh, this would be a fun thing to go do. And then you bring a friend.

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Lauren (21:24):

Totally. You say top of mind and you're like, this person's not been in my life for a long time but they keep adding value in my life. And then when somebody else has a conversation, this is a great group to talk with. So especially if you had a good experience to start with.

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Tiffany (21:38):

Exactly. 

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Lauren (21:40):

Okay.

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Tiffany (21:42):

Anything else we should cover? My dogs have decided they need to eat right now, or they have opinions on referrals, so hopefully they're not making too much noise. Oh, I know what I was going to mention too. NPS scores. I feel like those, and I think you mentioned in our notes here, so I'm going to take it away from you, but Google reviews, asking for other things that might just kind of trigger referral thinking. So can you fill out this NPS survey or end of your client survey? Things like that can kind of just trigger around it.

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Lauren (22:23):

So that brings up a point I think is worthwhile to distinguish. I feel like when you talk about referrals, right? There's almost like two parts. There's like how do you ask for the referral and then the nurturing of your COI. So a great way, I feel like to nurture, I'll call it COIs and clients, is be able to stay top of mind, ask for something. It could be what have you. It just creates an opportunity to be able to showcase that “I'm thinking of you” sort of thing. The asking for the referrals is, I feel like if you were going to put these into a pie or something like that, you're going to want the nurturing part to be 90% and the asking to be 10%. But the ask feels like it's done in a way where it's genuine. So optically it feels much more like nurturing than asking. You know what I mean?

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Tiffany (23:12):

Yeah.

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Lauren (23:13):

The ask will come naturally sort of out of it. At least that's kind of my vibe of it.

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Tiffany (23:16):

I agree.

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Lauren (23:16):

So yeah, I think that's a good way to just stay top of mind if you finished your relationship, you hadn't asked for anything in a while. You want to ask for a referral. You can do that. Another thing that sounds, I don't know, maybe might sound silly, but we're getting ready to send our holiday cards and I realized last year we sent some of the holiday cards to “no man's land” and they were returned.

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(23:45):

I was like, well, we better get the addresses. So we're spending some time this year reaching out, literally asking in a form, what's your address? And going through both referrals and community it's cool because people are like, we're getting conversations going. It's put some meetings on their calendar. It's just being top of mind. It's another way to nurture contacts in a way where it's like, we're thinking of you. We want you to know you're part of our circle, and I'm going to make the effort to not just send you a holiday card but start a conversation leading up to it. So little things like that.

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Tiffany (24:24):

I think that distinction is really important, that it's not just the ask but how are you maintaining a relationship?

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Lauren (24:32):

Or even recently, there's a group we've been building relationships with and they have events, they throw sponsorship events and they're like, we want you to join. It's going to be in your area. Come, and they're like, this will be great for you because we are rubbing shoulders with your natural network. So it's that kind of stuff. It's like adding people in the fold where it's actually a value to them.

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Tiffany (25:01):

Yep. I think that's the big takeaway: are you actually bringing value or are you just asking for sales?

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Lauren (25:07):

Yeah. Are you just a transaction?

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Tiffany (25:08):

Yeah. That's the big difference.

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Lauren (25:10):

Oh, that reminds me. I think a lot of people think they need to send tons of trinkets.

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Tiffany (25:15):

Yeah. 

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Lauren (25:17):

It can be good to stay top of mind, something out of the box but trinkets aren't going to close the referral. You have to still do the outreach.

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Tiffany (25:30):

Yeah, I agree. And maybe we can link it in here, but also just if you are going to do gifts, make sure they're meaningful. I know we just worked with someone with a NAPFA article. We've been sharing that one, which is really good. We'll link it here too, but just making sure gifts are actually meaningful and thoughtful and not just like you said, the latest trinket.

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Lauren (25:52):

Yeah, totally. With your logo all over it. I don't think anybody wants that, you know what I mean?

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Tiffany (25:59):

Yeah. Maybe they do. If they work for you.

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Lauren (26:00):

Yeah, you're on the team. 

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Tiffany (26:02):

Maybe we love our stuff, but not everybody wants an Out & About mug and things, so cool. Okay, so what's your number one takeaway? That's always the main question. What do I go do? That's one thing.

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Lauren (26:17):

Make it authentic, make it real. Come from a place of authenticity. I don't know all these different ways to slice and dice it, but yeah, if you're going to ask for a referral, I guess let's just put the ask aside. It's important to nurture. Just come from an authentic place of nurturing and adding value first, and then the referrals they'll follow. 

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Tiffany (26:40):

I love that. Yeah. I'd say something similar. Just make sure you're bringing real value to your marketing and to your relationships and all the things, and then I think it'll go from there. Yeah. Awesome. Well, anything else we need to cover?

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Lauren (26:59):

We can be here for a while. I feel like we go on all kinds of rabbit holes, so we better wrap it up. Or else we'll just be recording all day.

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Tiffany (27:04):

All right, well, thanks everyone for joining us. My dog is about ready to knock over the computer, so hopefully he doesn't.

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Lauren (27:13):

He's a big dog just for everyone's reference. He's not a pup like a little guy. 

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Tiffany (27:19):

He's excited we are done.

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Tiffany (27:23):

Well, thanks everyone for joining us. If you love this conversation and want to see more, hear more, make sure you go to outaboutcommunications.com/community. Sign up for the newsletter there. Speaking of value, we're always trying to make sure we're adding checklists and downloadables and all kinds of stuff in those monthly newsletters. So yeah, make sure you sign up for that and we'll keep the conversations going.

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